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Discretion is the better part of valor.

You should have used your head, and thought that through a little better, before you used them as a reference. That being said, if AMS needs contractors in your area, I don't think any two bit no compete clause would stop them from sending you work.
 

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You should have used your head, and thought that through a little better, before you used them as a reference. That being said, if AMS needs contractors in your area, I don't think any two bit no compete clause would stop them from sending you work.
I agree the only thing I wolud add is "Persistence" ditch the email, you don't want to be "that person" right now, the one that threatens them with your lawyer and knowing your rights etc. :sleep1:, your goal is to get work from them and with four mouths to feed you're not gonna let a cubicle jockey stop you , are you??...call them again...
 

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Discussion Starter · #4 ·
I agree the only thing I wolud add is "Persistence" ditch the email, you don't want to be "that person" right now, the one that threatens them with your lawyer and knowing your rights etc. :sleep1:, your goal is to get work from them and with four mouths to feed you're not gonna let a cubicle jockey stop you , are you??...call them again...
Lol, no. Maybe I wasn't clear enough with my post.
 

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What state are you in? If it is right to work state a non-compete is nearly impossible to enforce.

I would ask the neighbor for clarification about the "non-compete law." Play humble and stupid and see if they explain. Did you ever sign any kind of a contract with them? If so you should have a copy of it you can read to see if they snuck one in.

Keep calling AMS and talk to someone different and ask them why you being a sub is taboo. I am willing to bet your neighbor has talked crap about you to prevent you from being competition.

Also, keep looking for other companies to work for. There are lots of them out there, but the nationals tend to pay the best.
 

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If you did not sign a contract...there is no "no compete clause" that they can enforce...
I must say I have to agree with some of the comments here...that was a ballsy move...had you discussed thing prior to your actions you probably would not be here asking this question....

One if the big issues in the industry is people doing just what you have done thus creating an overload of contractors in an area....I have had 7 former employees do that....they are all out of business...

One last thing...if all you have is a w-9 you're an employee....I would bet on it....I posted something about contracts and what our local UEID said about a contract I got from a national company....
 

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I normally hate AMS! This time I have to commend them for not hiring you..... I would like to think that if AMS was happy with the service your "old employer" was providing to them then they should be loyal and not hire any subs of that "old employer".

Instead of 1 unhappy contractor (you) then AMS would have 2 unhappy contractors (you and ex employer) if you were hired PLUS..... instead of 1 "busy" contractor (ex employer) then if you are hired then there would be 2 "semi-busy" contractors (basically 2 broke contractors instead of 1) .

JMO... Sorry
 

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I call BS on the non-compete but if you've gone right from working for him, to trying to take his work then I agree that's not fair. I'm curious what the time frame is, how long has it been since you stopped working as his sub?

In any case, AMS isn't that wonderful so chin up buttercup ... you can find better work out there.
 

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Run from ams

:cry::censored:If you thought your EX employer:censored: was bad Try working for AMS:cry: I did when I first started and it took them 97 days to pay me:censored: becasue I was not a tier 1 company and you have to jump through hoops to get paid and once u complete the work they ding you for the smallest things "like the neighbor put trash in the wrong can they failed us on inspection :yes:and sent us back out to remove the garbage and delayed our payment from 15days to 45 days:furious: we worked for them for 4months and dumped them like a Hot box of Rocks!!!!! YES run as far as u can? there are plenty of Prop Pres companys just do your homework and find the right 1 for you also try the city they have abandon property contracts for cleanout & board ups around this time of the year to do grass cuts and boad ups?
Good Luck
DNMCEO
 

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AMD, it sounds like, from what you posted, that your old neighbor is still working for AMS. I also sounds like, by the rep asking you if you were subbing for him, that the neighbor made a phone call.
I have no problems with my subs striking out on their own; God bless them. But I have issues when someone tries to solicit my clients. Your old boss may be a fly dumping bonehead, that is pretty common. Best advice is stay on the other 22 contacts on your list and wait your old boss out, and when he drops off the radar, jump on the wagon.
 

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Discussion Starter · #14 ·
You start your own business in direct competition with your former employer and then you ask for a reference from him? You're surprised he acts weird about it? Some people.
Yeah, that'd be a great assumption. Except, I told them right from the start that was my intent and everything was fine with them. I could use them as a reference, they had more work than they could handle and they weren't concerned with me entering the business, yada yada yada. I think they never expected me to actually do what I said and once I did they were ticked. Well, tough. My husband quite his job of 16 years to start this and they knew that and still told us they would help us in if they could.
 

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Discussion Starter · #15 ·
:cry::censored:If you thought your EX employer:censored: was bad Try working for AMS:cry: I did when I first started and it took them 97 days to pay me:censored: becasue I was not a tier 1 company and you have to jump through hoops to get paid and once u complete the work they ding you for the smallest things "like the neighbor put trash in the wrong can they failed us on inspection :yes:and sent us back out to remove the garbage and delayed our payment from 15days to 45 days:furious: we worked for them for 4months and dumped them like a Hot box of Rocks!!!!! YES run as far as u can? there are plenty of Prop Pres companys just do your homework and find the right 1 for you also try the city they have abandon property contracts for cleanout & board ups around this time of the year to do grass cuts and boad ups?
Good Luck
DNMCEO
I wondered about that myself. I sub for another gentleman who is very easy to work with, I do the job he asks for, he's happy I get paid.
With the neighbors, it was quite crazy. I'd have to get out the toothbrush and scrub corners, spend all day getting rust off, clean under appliances and still get called back because a back corner behind and under the refrigerator had been missed. It seems a bit excessive.
 

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I don't know if I'm the only one, but I have all my employees sign this agreement at the same time they fill out the application, W9, and other employment forms:

For good consideration and as an inducement for employment with xxxxxx., _________________________(Employee/Sub-Contractor), the undersigned Employee/Sub-Contractor hereby agrees not to directly or indirectly compete, within the State of Alabama, with the business ofxxxxxxxxxxx. and its successors and assigns during the period of employment and for a period of one year following termination of employment and notwithstanding the cause or reason for termination.

The term "not compete" as used herein shall mean that the Employee/Sub-Contractor shall not own, manage, operate, consult or to be employee in a business substantially similar to or competitive with the present business of xxxxxxxxxxxx. or such other business activity in which xxxxxxxxxxxx. may substantially engage during the term of employment.

The Employee/Sub-Contractor acknowledges that xxxxxxxxxxxxxx, shall or may in reliance of this agreement provide Employee/Sub-Contractor access to trade secrets, customers, clients, and other confidential data and good will. Employee/Sub-Contractor agrees to retain said information as confidential and not to use said information on his or her own behalf or disclose same to any third party.

This agreement shall be binding upon and inure to the benefit of the parties, their successors, assigns, and personal representatives.


It's just a precaution, so that I don't spend 6 months training my competition. I have not had any sub-contractors sign this. I don't feel that is appropriate. I have no control over what another established contractor does. But, I also don't train my sub-contractors. I hire them to do specific jobs (roofing) for which they are already qualified.
 

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I wondered about that myself. I sub for another gentleman who is very easy to work with, I do the job he asks for, he's happy I get paid.
With the neighbors, it was quite crazy. I'd have to get out the toothbrush and scrub corners, spend all day getting rust off, clean under appliances and still get called back because a back corner behind and under the refrigerator had been missed. It seems a bit excessive.
You will find this difference between companies. It's a tangled web of what properties have to be done to what standards. I haven't worked directly for AMS, but I did have an ex-AMS employee working for me, and they had to clean like you said. But other homes aren't so strict. I would say this is a difference between types of properties, not that your neighbor was too excessive.
 

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Discussion Starter · #18 ·
I don't know if I'm the only one, but I have all my employees sign this agreement at the same time they fill out the application, W9, and other employment forms:

For good consideration and as an inducement for employment with xxxxxx., _________________________(Employee/Sub-Contractor), the undersigned Employee/Sub-Contractor hereby agrees not to directly or indirectly compete, within the State of Alabama, with the business ofxxxxxxxxxxx. and its successors and assigns during the period of employment and for a period of one year following termination of employment and notwithstanding the cause or reason for termination.

The term "not compete" as used herein shall mean that the Employee/Sub-Contractor shall not own, manage, operate, consult or to be employee in a business substantially similar to or competitive with the present business of xxxxxxxxxxxx. or such other business activity in which xxxxxxxxxxxx. may substantially engage during the term of employment.

The Employee/Sub-Contractor acknowledges that xxxxxxxxxxxxxx, shall or may in reliance of this agreement provide Employee/Sub-Contractor access to trade secrets, customers, clients, and other confidential data and good will. Employee/Sub-Contractor agrees to retain said information as confidential and not to use said information on his or her own behalf or disclose same to any third party.

This agreement shall be binding upon and inure to the benefit of the parties, their successors, assigns, and personal representatives.


It's just a precaution, so that I don't spend 6 months training my competition. I have not had any sub-contractors sign this. I don't feel that is appropriate. I have no control over what another established contractor does. But, I also don't train my sub-contractors. I hire them to do specific jobs (roofing) for which they are already qualified.
I completely agree, I have been very careful with what I have signed as far as other companies because every job builds my skills and I have had applications into nationals for months so I knew that I was going to go through regionals until one or a couple of the nationals called me. As a subcontractor, I feel I have to work with more than one so as not to put my eggs in one basket but also I thought I was careful not to step on toes.
I agree the training is what makes it so touchy, we knew each other and from what I got from our conversations before I had even started to try and branch out it was supposed to be more of a mentoring to a friend scenario.
Oh well, live and learn. I'm ready to move on.
 

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IMHO the expectations for a maid service are sky high and they pay is too low! Compare your pay to what it would cost if you were to hire merry maids or even a local independent maid service. My best advice to you would be try to branch out into Preservation or Maintenance where we don't do maid services.

Sounds like you are/were doing work from the HUD FSM contract? That usually goes to multiple companies (not just AMS) and the list is published. (I know, I know, this contradicts the advice I give above)

http://www.hud.gov/offices/cpo/contract/mnm/current/contract.cfm

Check out this link for the specific companies in your area:
http://portal.hud.gov/hudportal/documents/huddoc?id=DOC_4451.pdf
 

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Discussion Starter · #20 ·
IMHO the expectations for a maid service are sky high and they pay is too low! Compare your pay to what it would cost if you were to hire merry maids or even a local independent maid service. My best advice to you would be try to branch out into Preservation or Maintenance where we don't do maid services.

Sounds like you are/were doing work from the HUD FSM contract? That usually goes to multiple companies (not just AMS) and the list is published. (I know, I know, this contradicts the advice I give above)

http://www.hud.gov/offices/cpo/contract/mnm/current/contract.cfm

Check out this link for the specific companies in your area:
http://portal.hud.gov/hudportal/documents/huddoc?id=DOC_4451.pdf
Thank you so much! Applied to a lot but apparently not the right ones, still have a lot to learn. :thumbsup:
 
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