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Discussion Starter #1
Since the Hitler moderator banned me for 3 months over yonder for calling him out about enforcing NOT discussing pricing because it's an "UNWRITTEN" rule i cannot post in the AMS thread there. Here is my take on it. I CANNOT make any money with Safeguard on Fannie properties. Most of my properties are rural and 75% are cash for keys with NO DEBRIS.

#1. I pay out on average $150 for cleaning to my cleaning people and Safeguard pays 120 after discount. LOSS!!

#2. $64 Net for an acre up to 12"????? ROTFLMAO!! LOSS!!

#3. $144 Net for an acre up to 36"????? Friggen NUTS!!!!

#4 $28 Net for up to a 75' driveway up to 12" deep snow??? Doesn't pay to leave my driveway!

I much prefer a flat rate. At least i'm not going backwards! I would need 12 Cu Yds of debris MINIMUM in EVERY house with Safeguard to compare to the flat rate i had negotiated with AMS. Granted i was higher than what you guys in Michigan are being quoted but we are in a MUCH harder to cover state. There is also MUCH MORE COMPUTER TIME! Figure 30-45 minutes MINIMUM for every Safeguard initial upload and at least 10 minutes for a routine. AMS takes 5-10 minutes tops for an initial and less than 5 for a routine. Next the expense of E&O which AMS does not require, $3,0000 per year for me. Finally the zones are all screwed up. The Safeguard zone i am in is over 100 miles top to bottom and 80 miles across. I could potentially drive 100 miles round trip for 1 routine!! All around i don't know how anyone makes any money on Safeguard REO's............


If you Michigan guys are getting what i have heard:
$325 for 35cuyd or less
$95 for janitorial
$80 up to one acre cut. (BTW, if the grass is tall, AMS WILL negotiate)

You will need more than 9 cu yds in every home to be better with Safeguard.
 

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Since the Hitler moderator banned me for 3 months over yonder for calling him out about enforcing NOT discussing pricing because it's an "UNWRITTEN" rule i cannot post in the AMS thread there.
So they threw you in the hole huh? Cool Hand Luke. My money says you can down the 50 hard boiled eggs in an hour.
 

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I've done one or 10 Fannie's for SG.


12 yrds ONLY of debris, whats that???????????????????????


25 to 40 in every one is common. Make a few bux there, but then the initial clean is a killer.
Because none of the houses were even remotely live in condition.
I've had ones that after 16 man hrs of cleaning might have been clean enough for merry maids to come in and spend 2 or 3 days getting it move in clean.


Winter/spring of 2011 I had enough Fannie work from SG that it allowed me to cash money around $12,000 in lawn equipment.
Some new, some used.
 

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On the REO side with SG it's about using the allowables. AMS said they have $100 to approve on the spot, everything else needs bid. SG typically has a lot of pre-approved items so you don't have to go back to the property a half dozen times.
 

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Discussion Starter #7
On the REO side with SG it's about using the allowables. AMS said they have $100 to approve on the spot, everything else needs bid. SG typically has a lot of pre-approved items so you don't have to go back to the property a half dozen times.

AMS has $500 in allowables. I would say 75-80% of the Fannie work i had was houses less than 10 years old in very good condition. Had 5 in July and only 1 had more than a bag of garbage. It had 5 cu. yds...............
 

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Hmm. They told me $100 total and then anything over that need bid. I almost never see low CYD houses. 20-40 is very common.
 

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Discussion Starter #9
Hmm. They told me $100 total and then anything over that need bid. I almost never see low CYD houses. 20-40 is very common.

Most here that are not cash for keys are conveyance condition when i get them.

On a side note, Safeguard is taking a 25% discount on REO so my grass pricing above is wrong. They also have have hired one contractor (AKA a regional) to cover all the grass re-cuts in one of the hardest to cover states in the country. The regional will then take another 20-25% leaving peanuts left. ($39- $42 for an acre???????????) QC is going to have a hayday with Safeguard and the brokers will not put up with it. Personally i give them less than 3 months to fall apart here. Hell is Sentinel is having a hard time getting people to cut 1/4 acre for $25 how in the hell is Safeguard going to get someone to cut an acre for $14 more???

Brokers also want to be kept in the loop and Safeguard is NOTORIOUS for doing there thing and not telling anyone. For example, All boilers here ARE NOT TO BE WINTERIZED per the brokers, Heat is to be left on. Nice blinds and curtain rods are to stay. Paint that is in good condition is to stay for touch ups if the home has recently been painted, Building materials are to be left if they match what is in the house IE: trim and ceramic tile. All of this makes repairs easier. I have had more than one nice house that took me 2-3 trips to Sherwin Williams to match paint because another contractor has tossed out leftover matching paint. FNMA has told the brokers they have the final say and i work VERY close with the brokers to get these homes sold.
 

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We do a decent volume with AMS and a few other nationals. These prices you guys are quoting are insane.

My worst paying client is paying $45.00 for a routine cut and $125.00 for initials. I think some people out there need to learn to say no.
 

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really dobbie $125.00 for an intial g.c shoot me that contact the scrubs out here only pay $40.00 im in cali i wont be stepping on your toes also i see alot of guys paying a % to work whats that all about ? why do you have to pay a % to work ?
 

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really dobbie $125.00 for an intial g.c shoot me that contact the scrubs out here only pay $40.00 im in cali i wont be stepping on your toes also i see alot of guys paying a % to work whats that all about ? why do you have to pay a % to work ?
The clients pay based on what the banks pay and the more properties a bank has the less the pay.

You should read the HUD guidelines and determine what the grass cuts you do pay. Once you have an understanding of what the bank is paying and you know what you are getting figure out who is getting the rest and why.

We work every day towards climbing the ladder so that we are not doing grass cuts for $30.00. It all starts with the banks.
 

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Mtmtnman 100% right

I work in the new York area (Brooklyn ,Bronx,queens) and they want to pay 20 dollars per cut at the end of the day I would owe them money
Gas tolls insurance labor tools supplies etc..... Who comes up with these prices and who the HELL is doing them and making money?


I called national asset protection agency the other day to see if they were looking for vendors and they said we would send an application. When I opened the price list they offered I almost had a heartache

They said to remove debris they were offering 12.50 cubic yard LMAO. A 20 yard dumpster here alone is 700-800

Sorry about the ranting but I am frustrated

We all need to stick together and tell these idiots find someone else
 

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I work in the new York area (Brooklyn ,Bronx,queens) and they want to pay 20 dollars per cut at the end of the day I would owe them money
Gas tolls insurance labor tools supplies etc..... Who comes up with these prices and who the HELL is doing them and making money?


I called national asset protection agency the other day to see if they were looking for vendors and they said we would send an application. When I opened the price list they offered I almost had a heartache

They said to remove debris they were offering 12.50 cubic yard LMAO. A 20 yard dumpster here alone is 700-800

Sorry about the ranting but I am frustrated

We all need to stick together and tell these idiots find someone else
You are right about banding together for sure.

We NEVER use a dumpster for a trash out. They just slow us down.
 

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In some situations they are the best thing.

Most of the time they are too costly.


I did have one back in April that the cost of the 30 yrd was reasonable.
With 110 yrds of debris having to load it all on a trailer and then run to the dump and unload, come
back and reload etc etc etc............ would have taken a lot longer than 3 dumpsters and one load
of scrap steel for recycle.
 

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In some situations they are the best thing.

Most of the time they are too costly.


I did have one back in April that the cost of the 30 yrd was reasonable.
With 110 yrds of debris having to load it all on a trailer and then run to the dump and unload, come
back and reload etc etc etc............ would have taken a lot longer than 3 dumpsters and one load
of scrap steel for recycle.
I never separate out scrap. I know I should it just seems like it takes SOO much time for such little profit. I have always felt like we would make more just going to the next job faster.

Dumpsters around here are expensive but the real problem is waiting for the company to come empty them and all of the coordination involved. I normally just double up my crews and use multiple dump trailers. Sometimes the dump fees can be as much as a dumpster would have been but the time I save offsets it. I am sure every area is different though.
 

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I never separate out scrap. I know I should it just seems like it takes SOO much time for such little profit. I have always felt like we would make more just going to the next job faster.

Dumpsters around here are expensive but the real problem is waiting for the company to come empty them and all of the coordination involved. I normally just double up my crews and use multiple dump trailers. Sometimes the dump fees can be as much as a dumpster would have been but the time I save offsets it. I am sure every area is different though.
We dont use dump trailers at all. course most of our work is presale so we dont take much debris. did a stint in reo when NFR got AHMSI (Homeward) safeguard does the reo for them now but i still get presale stuff. anyway while i was doing reo i was using a dumpster company and i was paying $325 flat for a 20yd, $375 for a 30yd. after doing the math i decided that it just didnt make sense to lug a dump trailer around in place of my equipment trailer. besides we could have the dumpster dropped in 24hrs and pulled same day so it was easiler to do more jobs if we could use our equipment trailers to complete jobs and the dump company to handle debris.

one day recently a 4 man crew (including myself) with one truck and trailer did 2 reo's (about 30yrds each) and 5 initial secures (presale) without putting a single bit of debris on my trailer (if you seen my trailer you'd know why i appreciate that). if i had a dump trailer it would have involved too many trips and crews to get the same amount of work done. by the time you factor fuel for at another truck to make dump runs and pay for the guys, plus the other work that might not have gotten done it was well worth it. i've repeated that model about 10 times in my brief reo stint and it worked nicely. however, screw reo, i hated it and will not be doing it ever again.
 

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Discussion Starter #19
however, screw reo, i hated it and will not be doing it ever again.

I feel the same about presale work. To much risk involved. I have NEVER run itno a digruntled homeowner on an REO but ran into plenty on presale. REO is cakewalk and no where near the amount of paperwork.........
 

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I feel the same about presale work. To much risk involved. I have NEVER run itno a digruntled homeowner on an REO but ran into plenty on presale. REO is cakewalk and no where near the amount of paperwork.........
I started 10 years ago doing pre sale so its all ive ever done Been sued once. It sucks but seems to be part of the business. I don't like all the detail Involved in Reo.
 
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