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Discussion Starter #1
Is anyone working with Cyprexx?
They contacted us want us to do Fannie Mae work for them. However, we are very reluctant to sign any agreements with them.
We could not add them to our insurance, and when we started looking for an insurance company that would add them our premium would increase 77%....That is not a misprint...3600 bucks more to have them on our insurance....
They pay this flat rate thing...$365 includes the following;
Sales clean
lawn, up to 1 acre
debris removal up to 20 cyds
These numbers seem so rediculouslly low...
Is anyone working for them and can you make their numbers work?
We have done Fannie Mae work before and this just seems like a joke.
we did some work for them (Cyprexx)a few years ago but they only gave us recuts and maids, so we stopped.
Would appreciate any input on them...I just do not see being able to make a profit.
 
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Discussion Starter #2
Good Morning,

I wouldn't do any work for them at those prices even if I owned a landfill and the property was right next door to me.
 

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Cleanupman said:
Is anyone working with Cyprexx?
They contacted us want us to do Fannie Mae work for them. However, we are very reluctant to sign any agreements with them.
We could not add them to our insurance, and when we started looking for an insurance company that would add them our premium would increase 77%....That is not a misprint...3600 bucks more to have them on our insurance....
They pay this flat rate thing...$365 includes the following;
Sales clean
lawn, up to 1 acre
debris removal up to 20 cyds
These numbers seem so rediculouslly low...
Is anyone working for them and can you make their numbers work?
We have done Fannie Mae work before and this just seems like a joke.
we did some work for them (Cyprexx)a few years ago but they only gave us recuts and maids, so we stopped.
Would appreciate any input on them...I just do not see being able to make a profit.
I declined a lot of work from them this past year. One of their hack contractors used one of my BAC properties as a dumping ground for tree clippings. Or so the neighbor says.
 

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So what is the reason that your insurance carrier won't add them???


I need to know this, because they just contacted me to do some work for them.
 

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BPWY said:
So what is the reason that your insurance carrier won't add them???

I need to know this, because they just contacted me to do some work for them.
Paul,

It's due to the huge amount of insurance claims they file and claims filed against them, safeguard, FAS etc. That's the reason for the new mortgage field services specific policy. American Family Insurance started doing this 2 years ago. They even told FAS F off on a few jobs and sent their own contractors to perform the work instead of paying out claims.

I'll pm or email you more info.
 

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Cleanupman said:
Is anyone working with Cyprexx?
They contacted us want us to do Fannie Mae work for them. However, we are very reluctant to sign any agreements with them.
We could not add them to our insurance, and when we started looking for an insurance company that would add them our premium would increase 77%....That is not a misprint...3600 bucks more to have them on our insurance....
They pay this flat rate thing...$365 includes the following;
Sales clean
lawn, up to 1 acre
debris removal up to 20 cyds
These numbers seem so rediculouslly low...
Is anyone working for them and can you make their numbers work?
We have done Fannie Mae work before and this just seems like a joke.
we did some work for them (Cyprexx)a few years ago but they only gave us recuts and maids, so we stopped.
Would appreciate any input on them...I just do not see being able to make a profit.


Do 10 jobs for $100 each or 1 job for $1000. Where are you better off? I get more that there base rate on 90% of the properties i do for them. (3-4 a month) They don't have FNMA up in these parts.....
 
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Discussion Starter #8
The contract at the numbers I psosted are specifically for FM properties with Cyprexx...no one else from Cyprexx contacted me, only a FM rep.
Our agent says this...
When something happenes and an attorney places et.al. on a legal document(which is a standard practice in law) The lawsuit legally attaches EVERY policy on the "additionally insured" so if Cyprexx(FAS) has say 7000 vendors and Cyprexx is named 'AI' 7000 times, the 1 or 2 mioolion dollar amount just got multiplied by 7000...
The reality is this...WE ARE insuring them....That's what our agent said...
Perhaps I should say that is how I understand it...now I did graduate with a minor in business law and from my preliminary research he (insurance agent) is correct....
Irregardless of the insurance issue...the numbers offered are a joke and we have said no...
I'm on an information mission just in case they come back with a counter.
The work the want us to do is a minimum &50-800 job, a far cry from 365. One could go broke real fast...
 

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Cleanup I've heard that from another source about the insurance.


I'm wondering how in the hell the insurance underwriters are tolerating this.
 
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Discussion Starter #10
BPWY said:
Cleanup I've heard that from another source about the insurance.


I'm wondering how in the hell the insurance underwriters are tolerating this.
They have stopped!!! Our company WILL insure us, however they WILL NOT add anyone as 'AI' or allow them to be the certificate holder.
We went to have Cyprexx added as 'AI' and our agent said no...
When we started looking into insurance we found to get a policy that would put them on our preimum would rise 77%...not a misprint 77%!!!!!
When I got back to them they jst stammered and hemmed and hawed...Had a meeting with my administrative people with the owner on the line and we are not going to get on board with them...
 
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Discussion Starter #11
Good Morning,

According to my insurance man, adding a company as a certificate holder doesn't insure the CH. All it means is that if there is a change to the policy, all the CH are informed of the change.


That is my understanding. Is this correct?
 
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Discussion Starter #12
Right now this may company specific...
For years American Family has handled all of our insurance needs.
This is something new in the industry. However, once one starts something it is not long before they all fall into line. There is a difference between a "Certificate Holder"
and additionally insured. The later insuring the company being added and holding the certificate. If a company is only the CH then that just proves you have insurance and are insured to do the work they send you.
If someone sues them they can not attach your policy...that changes when they are listed as additionall insured.
At leats that is my understanding
 
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72opp said:
Good Morning,

According to my insurance man, adding a company as a certificate holder doesn't insure the CH. All it means is that if there is a change to the policy, all the CH are informed of the change.


That is my understanding. Is this correct?
Your insurance man is correct for "certificate holder" BUT when the companies require you to put the Service Company as the Certificate Holder AND as an Additional Insured than the Service Company has as much "right" to your insurance policy as you do. Only difference is they are not the ones paying the premiums. Thus, You are providing insurance coverage for the Service Company.

Where the Insurance Industry is racing to catch up on this Property Preservation is that they have not been underwriting the RISK fully..ie the Service Company. Once the underwriters have determined that the Service Companies are willie nillie submitting claims against YOUR policy they will not allow the Additional Insured Endorsement to your policy without a hefty premium.

NOTE: that is the reason I have always posted that YOU most definately DO NOT WANT to purchase your General Liability or E&O Insurnace Policies from your "regular" insurance agent since they DO NOT offer the policies that pertain to the P&P Business. It will haunt you down the road. After 28 years as an Insurance Agency owner I will not write MY OWN policy---I'm dumb but not an idiot:laughing:

We have had the PLEASURE:censored: of Service Companies filing a claim on MY policy without ME/INSURED/PREMIUM PAYER having any SAY SO!!!! Not a damn thing you can do about it except to get your checkbook out and pay the deductible THEN pay the higher premiums on the Renewal for the claims loss ratios.

We have raised the deductible to $5000 per occurence and are fighting another willie nillie claim currently. We told the lawyers that we "do not have the $5000 deductible to pay and if you want to pay out the settlement that is not justified AT ALL then you will be the one absorbing the $5000---not I" So far this has stopped them in their tracks but I suspect they stopped till they can find $5000 in chargebacks from the Service Company so they can pay their BUDDIES THE LAWYERS. JMO
 
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Discussion Starter #14
Good Afternoon,

I have assumed that Service Companies will attempt to lay claims against my insurance. I figured this out after an unfortunate experience when I first started. Since then I have refused to add any Service Company that I associate with as an Additional Insured. I make this very clear to companies that "I will not insure your company under any circumstances. I will provide proof of my own insurance at your request and add you as a certificate holder but I will not insure your company." Most Service Companies I have informed of this policy understand and do not have a problem but there have been one or two that will no longer return phone calls or emails. It is my understanding that these Companies are not work my time.
 
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Discussion Starter #15
I did a few jobs for them over the past few years. I'd get the job about 1 out of 4 bids, i always just did winterizing and thaws and could name my price and theyd take it or not. I just sent them my ins certificates, well my agent did. My ins never went up as they are just a certificate holder, not actually on your insurance
 

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FremontREO said:
Your insurance man is correct for "certificate holder" BUT when the companies require you to put the Service Company as the Certificate Holder AND as an Additional Insured than the Service Company has as much "right" to your insurance policy as you do. Only difference is they are not the ones paying the premiums. Thus, You are providing insurance coverage for the Service Company.

Where the Insurance Industry is racing to catch up on this Property Preservation is that they have not been underwriting the RISK fully..ie the Service Company. Once the underwriters have determined that the Service Companies are willie nillie submitting claims against YOUR policy they will not allow the Additional Insured Endorsement to your policy without a hefty premium.

NOTE: that is the reason I have always posted that YOU most definately DO NOT WANT to purchase your General Liability or E&O Insurnace Policies from your "regular" insurance agent since they DO NOT offer the policies that pertain to the P&P Business. It will haunt you down the road. After 28 years as an Insurance Agency owner I will not write MY OWN policy---I'm dumb but not an idiot:laughing:

We have had the PLEASURE:censored: of Service Companies filing a claim on MY policy without ME/INSURED/PREMIUM PAYER having any SAY SO!!!! Not a damn thing you can do about it except to get your checkbook out and pay the deductible THEN pay the higher premiums on the Renewal for the claims loss ratios.

We have raised the deductible to $5000 per occurence and are fighting another willie nillie claim currently. We told the lawyers that we "do not have the $5000 deductible to pay and if you want to pay out the settlement that is not justified AT ALL then you will be the one absorbing the $5000---not I" So far this has stopped them in their tracks but I suspect they stopped till they can find $5000 in chargebacks from the Service Company so they can pay their BUDDIES THE LAWYERS. JMO
Unbelievable. I had to drop American Family after 5 years because of this nonsense. The good thing is I have OREP. I just wish USAA would do business insurance and GL with E&O. I'd save a lot more and I know they would tell these service companies to F--k off and sew them for bs claims.

Had a car accident that wasn't my fault that Progressive was disputing who was the responsible party, when common sense tells you as well as the police report that their insured was at fault. How can I be at fault when their insured ran a red light and t boned my truck? They refused to pay. USAA told me don't worry about it, just pay the deductible and we will pursue them and reimburse you or your policy for your $500 deductible. Within 3 days I had a refund and a new Sierra.

It's a good thing we have this CT forum to discuss and "complain" about our good and bad experiences in this field. So we know how about to better protect ourselves as well as how to handle some situations.
 
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Discussion Starter #17
Thats what and how subrogation works. They (Progressive) would't want to pay your claim to you since they are admitting liability for any possible liability/personal injury claims.
 
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thanohano44 said:
Unbelievable. I had to drop American Family after 5 years because of this nonsense. The good thing is I have OREP. I just wish USAA would do business insurance and GL with E&O. I'd save a lot more and I know they would tell these service companies to F--k off and sew them for bs claims.

Had a car accident that wasn't my fault that Progressive was disputing who was the responsible party, when common sense tells you as well as the police report that their insured was at fault. How can I be at fault when their insured ran a red light and t boned my truck? They refused to pay. USAA told me don't worry about it, just pay the deductible and we will pursue them and reimburse you or your policy for your $500 deductible. Within 3 days I had a refund and a new Sierra.

It's a good thing we have this CT forum to discuss and "complain" about our good and bad experiences in this field. So we know how about to better protect ourselves as well as how to handle some situations.
Progessive settled with your insurance company so quickly because they know they were in violation of the law. When liability is clearly determined, they have to do the right thing.

They know that, USAA new that, and that's why they settled real quickly once your insurance co. got involved. They would have been torn apart in court.
 
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Discussion Starter #19
We are doing work for them currently and would like to know if anyone else on this forum can share some light on how to make any money with them?
 
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Discussion Starter #20
Bid everything HIGH and the ones you do get will offset all the ones you wasted time on. Hopefully you get enough approvals that eventually you will see profit..
 
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